The second of the Farage-Clegg debates, this one sponsored by the BBC, was concluded less than a day ago, and the blood has been mopped up.
This second debate replayed many of the elements of the first, but the post debate polling, which had given the first debate to Farage 58%-36%, gave him this one also, but at 69%-28%.
While both these politicians seemed like scumbags in their own particular ways, Silverwolf would have to concur with the polls, not only in Farage’s debating execution, but also in a general sympathy with many of Farage’s views, while at the same time differing with him on several points in which Silverwolf agreed with Clegg.
We think this debate is quite prescient in illustrating what is going to happen in Western politics, and we think this will follow similar patterns in many societies. Thus, these two debates were quite significant precursers of future political trends.
Nick Clegg sounded very much like the Democrats in America, losing ground, and desperately trying to talk themselves out of a hole, while using inaccurate, legalistic language. Like Clinton’s legal deposition, and Obama’s “If you like your insurance, you can keep it”, Clegg’s assertion than only 7% of British legislation originated in Brussels as per a House of Commons report, was an legalistic lie. Farage then quoted from the same report as saying that an estimated 50% of all British legislation originated in Brussels, and then Clegg had to amend his lie by saying that 7% of all “primary” legislation originated there — that shows what an obfuscating liar Clegg is, and the usual worthless scumbag politician. He also went down the line, hitting all the correct issue buttons and catchphrases which the scientific brainwashing propagandists have told him win votes. It was sickening to see him mouth the same phrases, over and over, the same arguments over and over, and it’s no wonder that he lost. He is the Tony Blair clone, and dares to call himself a Liberal, when all he wants is more power for the mega-corporations, and having Englishmen slave for these foreign-owned companies, while anything the workers accumulate in what Clegg had the audacity to call “hard cash” is inflated away at whim by the Western central banks whenever the corporations call them on the carpet. Inflation keeps people slaving away all over the world; it is one of the chief tools of the collectivists for making sure that people never get out of their poverty, or economic rut.
Clegg had the audacity to say that it was all about “jobs, jobs, jobs,”, but the true aim of the free-market capitalist would be a society in which there was vast leisure, and people didn’t have to do these mind-deadening jobs, 40 hours a week. In a truly Capitalist society, with the Individual always placed above the Corporation, most people would be affluent, and would usually only work when they had the inclination. And they would have that inclination, not only for the remunerative rewards, but also because they enjoyed doing the work.
Such a truly Capitalist society would actually be the fulfillment of the oft quoted goal of the Communists: From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs. This is exactly what would quickly result in a few generations at most in a truly free-market Capitalist society, with a Jeffersonian-Bill of Rights, and a Republic or Parliamentary Democracy with democratic elections to choose the representatives, and a rigorous separation of Church and State. Such a radically free society, the epitome of Classical Liberalism, or Libertarianism as it is now called, would bring about, paradoxically, a society very close to the Communist’s ideal, and would result in a vast increase in human happiness, as well as a vast decrease in mankind’s misery.
Another very weak point for Clegg was Farage’s production of a Clegg flyer from 2008 saying that he was then in favor of a referendum, but now he was against it, and that original promise had never been fulfilled. Clegg tried to make a case why a Democratic Referendum being put to the British voters was a bad idea right now. (And here he pulled the “our economy is so fragile and just recovering and this would be dangerous” argument while earlier he’d been touting all the wonderful economic benefits that EU membership has brought Britain. Man, do these goons readily think the public is that stupid, that they can’t see the lying words, and the absurd arguments, like a bad lawyer trying to defend a weak case?)
When it came to Farage’s weaknesses, it was his arguments against “involvement” in Syria, as if carpet bombing Assad’s government buildings would have involved British boots on the ground, and the little smile Farage gave when Clegg quoted Farage’s quote on Putin playing Syria masterfully, as if it were a game, showed that Farage is an immoralist too. And to say that Libya would be better under a Li’l Hitler like Moammar Ghadaffi, a Mass Murderer, a Mass Torturer, and a War Criminal (napalm in Chad), than it now is shows that Farage, like Clegg, is also an immoral scumbag. Nor was Silverwolf enamoured with Farage’s enthusiasm for fracking and nuclear energy, or his denial of global warming, which seems pretty self-evidently true from the erratic weather patterns and droughts, and increase in ferocity of typhoons and tornadoes. Global warming may not exist, but it would be prudent to act as if it did exist, rather than do irreversible harm by continuing to ignore it. But look at the lying and hypocritical Obama Administration. While Kerry is wailing about innaction on global warming, Democrat Senators Wyden and Merkley, as well as Liberal Democrat Peter DeFazio are all braying for a vast expansion in logging in the Oregon forests, what is left of them. Solar energy is obviously man’s ultimate solution, the problem of disposal of nuclear waste still not being satisfactorily solved, and sunlight being as abundant and free as air.
Clegg, for his part was wrong on the Ukraine, where he echoes the Orwellian Newspeak of the West, ignoring the fact that this was a democratically-elected government overthrown by violent mobs which have installed two Nazi parties, Pravy Sektor and Svoboda, in power on the border of Russia. Farage took exactly the correct position on this issue, and said he could well understand why Putin has acted like he has, and why he feels threatened, given the recent words of NATO leaders and Ukraine’s Nazi government.
Clegg’s argument that Britain has more clout being in the EU than it has out was one of his weakest arguments, along with his opposition to a democratic referendum on the issue. An opposition he shares with PM Cameron of the Conservatives, and MP Milliband, head of the Labour Party, — all of whom oppose giving the British electorate a democratic chance to state their views via a referendum. Perhaps that was Clegg’s feeblest argument of the whole debate. (And it is interesting that Milliband has asked that Farage be banned from the TV debates in the upcoming elections. Those Leftists love censorship, despite their claims of loving free speech and democracy.)
Clegg made a big show of saying, yes, the British should and, he promised, would vote by referendum on any changes in EU laws, but then Farage pointed out that new laws and regulations are made almost weekly, and that the British haven’t voted by referendum on in EU in over 40 years. This made Clegg’s promise seem very hollow indeed.
Clegg also made a royal lie when he claimed that Farage had said that 400-plus million EU workers would flood Britain, while Farage had clearly said that they could, he never said they would. He merely said that, under current EU rules, they would be able to. This is the type of cheap shot that destroys a politician’s credibility.
There were two more sickening and subtle lies these politicians put forth in there delivery: one for each of them.
Clegg has this collectivist way of saying “we” and “us” when he refers to the wealth of the whole country, but when a stock-owner of a foreign corporation takes a dividend out of British industry, how does that benefit the charwoman? These collectivist’s “we”s and “us”es are used by American and British politicians to refer to the entire society, but the only reality you have of America or Britain is the everyday experiences you live through, the specific people you meet and interact with, and your relationship with them, and the place you live in and the surroundings. These are “you”, not some fictious “we” when the politician says “we are stronger for being in the EU” or similar lying generalities. That generality is not a reality, but the purchasing power of the charwoman’s hourly wage is, to her. She could care less about Britain’s balance of trade, or getting rid of roaming charges for the bourgeoisie tourists who go to Europe, when she can barely afford bus fare to and from work. When politicians say “we” and “us” in refering to the economy, run from them.
Farage’s big lie was on the function of government, which he put as some vague increasing of opportunities. Pure pablum, and way off base. You’d think that a British politician would know better, but things must have gone way down in Old Blighty since the days of Cromwell and the Glorious Revolution. Libertarians know that government has one fundamental function: the defence of property rights, which includes your body, and the defence of the Jeffersonian Bill of Rights and your inalienable rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, which in earlier documents was termed “property”. (Jefferson had the insight to see that the only real use of property was the pursuit of happiness, and that varied with each individual.) Moreover, the Libertarian has one core axiom to measure any political proposal: the non-aggression axiom which states that no man or group of men may aggress against the property rights of any individual.
Incidentally, it is interesting to speculate that, while England fought a ferocious war for survival against the German Nazis of WW II, they could now be legally invaded by tens of millions of Germans, and not be able to say a word agin it. So much for British Sovereignty. Deutschland Uber England may be the slogan of the future if Clegg gets his druthers.
We’d guess these debates will go a long way to strengthen Farage’s political position, and the positions of politicians who parrot his views. These views are on the rise, and as he correctly pointed out, the failures of Euro-collectivism are leading to more and more extremism from Nazis and other, economically-starved masses. Jeffersonian free-markets lead to true Liberalism; Clegg’s brand of “Liberalism”, which is its opposite in reality, leads to political extremism and Fascism. You can see it in Greece, in Hungary, and in Ukraine. Western governments, like Obama’s and Cameron’s, and their collaborating “opposition” parties, are losing ground with the public, who now get to hear clearly stated real opposition.
While both Clegg and Farage are propagandists and liars, it is clear from the debate results poll in whom the public places more credence.
Hooooooooooooowwwwwwwwwwww! — Silverwolf